Wayne Jones - Let's Learn Together - The PIT Show Preseason

Jay Miller

Sep 01, 2020 16:46 PM

This is the PIT Show, a new format combining reflections and interviews with people working in technology. We're in the preseason so expect some changes, but we kick this off with an explainer, an interview with Wayne Jones and a tribute to Chadwick Boseman.


Jay 00:00:00:

everybody, it's J real quick.

Jay 00:00:03:

There's gonna be a music change. Just so you know, we've been publishing these videos to YouTube. You can find more about that on productivity and tech dot com,

Jay 00:00:13:

but because we're gonna be pushing more and more on YouTube, I'm not able to use the existing Intron Outro music due to licensing reasons. Even though I've been given permission, I'm still going to get copyright strikes. So we've changed up the music. It's gonna be the music for the

Jay 00:00:34:

future until something changes it. So

Jay 00:00:38:

that's it. I'm also going to be doing a little bit with the rebranding, getting things done early. So there may be a little disconnect in the recorded audio in the interview and the intro. That's it.

Jay 00:00:56:

Under the show.

Jay 00:00:59:

It's too stays.

Jay 00:01:20:

What's up, everybody? I'm J. Miller. This is the pit show. Now, you might be wondering. Wait a minute. I thought this was productivity and yeah, I know. We're gonna We're gonna talk about that in just a second. But I'm so glad that you are able to join me today. I've got a great interview coming up, but first, let's dive into this.

Jay 00:01:42:

So what is this? Whatever you're looking at now,

Jay 00:01:45:

basically, the show has taken on this format. That was kind of by accident, where I started doing

Jay 00:01:56:

a reflection in an interview and a reflection and an interview and inter flexion and a review and all of these other things. But

Jay 00:02:07:

I kind of got tired of that. Honestly, I felt like what was really happening was that you were getting to shows and I thought to myself, If you're going to get two shows, why don't I just give you two shows, but not in the way that you think

Jay 00:02:22:

I didn't want to give you

Jay 00:02:25:

another feed? In fact, once upon a time, there used to be a show called The Pit Reflections, where literally, it was just me thinking and doing and talking and doing all that stuff. So if I wasn't going to give you two podcasts, but I was going to give you

Jay 00:02:42:

basically two different parts to one show, how could I do it better?

Jay 00:02:48:

And the solution that I came to was one that I really enjoyed.

Jay 00:02:53:

So here it is. Basically, you're going to get me talking just like I am now for a few minutes on every show.

Jay 00:03:01:

I'm gonna be talking a little bit about the subject that my guests will be talking about. I'll be talking a little bit about what's going on in my week. I'll be talking about a little bit. What's going on in, ah, current events? And then we'll jump into my interview

Jay 00:03:16:

now. In that interview,

Jay 00:03:18:

it will be the same interview that you're used to just a little bit shorter.

Jay 00:03:22:

Probably about 15 to 20 minutes sometimes maybe even 10 minutes. But here's the thing. I'm still going to give you the whole interview and I do that a couple of ways. One, I'm gonna stretch the interviews out a little bit. I'm going to cover a couple of different topics so that you can see

Jay 00:03:42:

that different parts of my guests as we're talking about things, and we often do this anyway. We often talk about

Jay 00:03:51:

a couple of different areas in their life, so it makes sense to do that anyway.

Jay 00:03:59:

Now, if you want to listen to the entire interview, you can still do that. I'm gonna be making the full interview available when the first episode drops on the bonus feed now for those that are listening to this for the first time, and you're just like this whole thing is just blowing my mind right now. The bonus feed is simply a free podcast that is available via the RSS feed only now there's a reason I do that one. I want to make sure that I'm able to put all of my focus and energy in the main show, but I also want to make sure that people are still getting the content that they want and deserve.

Jay 00:04:37:

So in order to get this bonus feed, all you have to do is sign up for

Jay 00:04:44:

the pit newsletter, go over to productivity in tech dot com, click the newsletter Link. Put your email address in. It's going to give you the RSS feed as your confirmation.

Jay 00:04:55:

If you unsubscribe after that, sure, whatever, that's fine. As long as you follow those steps, you'll get access to the bonus feet.

Jay 00:05:05:


Jay 00:05:06:

you might be wondering, Is this gonna be a lot more work? You're right. It ISS.

Jay 00:05:12:

Every once in a while, I'm going to talk about a product or a thing that I'm doing or trying or looking at and those will probably have affiliate codes. Now, I try to think what would be the best way for me to

Jay 00:05:29:

make a little bit of money off of this show toe make up for the effort and the work that I'm putting in without selling your data without giving your information to third parties and the affiliate market is still probably the best way. In fact, it's kind of bad for me because I don't make that much off of affiliate revenue. I mean, I think last month on Amazon I made a whole $1.5. So there is that. But

Jay 00:05:55:

at the end of the day, the pit show is just one piece of an overall business that is productivity in tech. So I'm not too worried about making money on this side of it, because I'm gonna be making money from my clients that I work with. And also, you know, I've got a day job, so ah, lot of this is from the heart. A lot of this is just me wanting to show my passion and show my love for the things that I talk about. The guests that I bring on and The only way that I can continue to do that is that I make sure that there are no strings attached on the monetary side.

Jay 00:06:38:

So the last thing you might be thinking is what about the after show? The after show is still gonna be there. Still gonna be on the bonus feed. If you want it, you get it. It will be on a separate track from the

Jay 00:06:50:

full conversation. I'm still going to do that for you because I know some people prefer the after shows over the main shows. Some people don't want to listen to the after shows.

Jay 00:07:00:

I'm okay with all of that.

Jay 00:07:03:

So that's it. This is the pit show. This is the new thing. We got the new music at the interview. Still got the reflections. Still, I'm gonna skip the early reflection on this one and dive right into the interview.

Jay 00:07:15:

So this first interview waas with someone that I had just met online. I had listened to them give a talk about one of the projects that they had, and we'll get more to detail about that project on the second part of this conversation. But here it is, my conversation with Wayne Jones

Jay 00:07:40:

on the line with me. I have

Jay 00:07:43:

N Y u Grad, currently a full stack software engineer, and you can often catch him learning and hacking away on twitch the one the only Wayne Jones coming away from New York City. Weighing How are you doing this evening?

Wayne 00:08:00:

Doing are a just chillin weather's nice, So enjoying it.

Jay 00:08:05:

So this is this is one of the cool conversations that I've had just recently of, like, this idea of connecting with more and more developers online that are

Jay 00:08:17:

like, not giving keynote speeches. And then you gotta, like, try to send the email out and be like, Hey, sir, my you know, for you to be on my podcast, like being able to catch people on switch, doing cool stuff and ah,

Jay 00:08:30:

man is interesting because I've been watching a lot of the coding stuff that you've been doing lately, and I'm

Jay 00:08:37:

I feel like I'm annoying you at times because it's just like, Hey, man, I know, I know you're just trying to show that you can do this, but shouldn't that be like

Wayne 00:08:47:

now, like I love the, um, the coding community on twitch and It's very fun, like, very helpful as well. Especially if I

Wayne 00:08:57:

going to a roadblock when it comes to coding and not necessarily knowing how to solve a solution.

Wayne 00:09:04:

Community is definitely there to help. Um, yeah,

Jay 00:09:08:

how How has that been? Because I just got into, like, doing a lot more like coding live streams. And I've noticed more and more like you have a couple of types of folks that come into the stream. You have the people that, like know what they're doing and are just there to tell you that you're doing it wrong. And then you also have, like, the people that have, like, no idea what's going on. So they're just asking 1000 questions. And you're like,

Jay 00:09:35:

as much as I want to help you right now,

Jay 00:09:38:

I'm trying to figure this out like I can't answer this question because I don't know the answer.

Wayne 00:09:44:

Yeah, and like it,

Wayne 00:09:47:

it's like for some of my streams, like I do algorithm type questions. So this is like the typical questions you'll see in a technical interview and then some streams. I'm doing like, uh,

Wayne 00:10:00:

doing like, my own assignment. A coding assignments, um,

Wayne 00:10:05:

or maybe a personal project that, like it seems like

Wayne 00:10:09:

depending on what type of content that I'm doing, you would have different types of people that are, um,

Wayne 00:10:16:

watching your stream. So, like, for algorithm questions, those are typically the people that are trying to learn a little bit more about, um,

Wayne 00:10:24:

coding in general,

Wayne 00:10:26:

building out your algorithms had optimized solution. Um,

Wayne 00:10:31:

And for me, um,

Wayne 00:10:34:

in terms of like doing these streams,

Wayne 00:10:36:

I am not only the person that, like

Wayne 00:10:40:

I guess can give the answers when it comes to like, these algorithm type questions. But also, I'm learning as well as I'm coding eso. It's just like I'm learning from the community. Um, pretty much coding as I go that I call it where it's like

Wayne 00:10:56:

it puts it more into perspective.

Wayne 00:10:59:


Wayne 00:11:00:

when you're watching a stream like minds because

Wayne 00:11:03:

me personally, I'm a developer for six years as a full stack Web developer, but

Wayne 00:11:09:

even myself, with all these years of experience, I don't have all the answers and you'll see me make stupid mistakes. You'll see me have, like, syntax, errors of missing semi colon, and it will take me like 30 minutes, debug and I'm like,

Wayne 00:11:26:

uh, face palming the entire time once I figure out the answer to my problems, but

Wayne 00:11:32:

yeah, it's

Wayne 00:11:33:

it puts, I guess, my shame in general. Just put ST Moritz respect. Perspective. Um,

Wayne 00:11:39:

when it comes suggests learning with me, learning the fundamentals of coding. Andi,

Wayne 00:11:47:

just like program, lingers in general.

Jay 00:11:50:

No, I love that. And I love that. Like one of the things that you were talking about there is like

Jay 00:11:55:

being being able to

Jay 00:11:58:

stream, even though you don't have all the answers. Like, I think that that's

Jay 00:12:03:

that's such a

Jay 00:12:06:

strange thing because, you know, one of the things that I've always I've always tried to like, tell people like you don't have to always put

Jay 00:12:13:

your best foot forward, but like at least show that you're trying to put your best before like

Jay 00:12:22:

no one expects everyone to have, like all the answers 100% of time. Well, I'm wrong. The Internet expects you to have all the answers are present at the time, But people in reality,

Jay 00:12:35:

I feel like it's easier to relate to someone who is struggling, and in fact that's

Jay 00:12:40:

one of the things that we have in common is we both stream like late at night and I can only imagine, like

Jay 00:12:47:

for me when I'm streaming I've been working all day, I get double work and I'm like, All right now it's timeto start writing code for projects that I'm passionate about, and it's like I'm so tired like I can't think about this. And so many times I've just been like, all right, where stream is over. Like, Let's we're calling it here because I can't figure this out. And then the very next morning, like, I come up with solution in like, 20 minutes and I'm like saying I should have just went to sleep earlier and then I would have had

Wayne 00:13:16:

the problem.

Jay 00:13:16:

That the answer. Do you have the same problem? Like I know you stream late at night to write?

Wayne 00:13:21:

Yeah, I stood in late tonight here in New York. Um, so it goes to, like,

Wayne 00:13:26:

maybe I start machine maybe around 6 to 7 p.m. Even though I've been wanting to start a little bit earlier. But I usually end my streams around like midnight one AM and I'm like,

Jay 00:13:37:

i e I'm done. I

Wayne 00:13:40:

need to stop here, so I'm not getting any sleep.

Jay 00:13:43:

Has screaming kind of been like the replacement for going to meet ups and local events?

Wayne 00:13:49:

Yeah, well, streaming in general like

Wayne 00:13:53:

like for me personally before pre cove it. I've never went to any developer conferences to learn about new technologies. And I guess this covert situation I guess the pros out of this, if you can call it that, is that most of these deaf conferences air now online. And now you can just, uh, sign up. Most of them were for free. You can go online and learn something new. Eso for me. Personally, I've been focused mainly on react, but I've been babbling into a little bit more about continue ization including docker kubernetes um, learning a little bit more about no Js on the back end on. And, of course, just doing things that manipulating things to react

Wayne 00:14:42:

dollars to, like fast since the colors and then, um, paying for travel and lodging,

Wayne 00:14:50:

it's just the costs adds up on. And of course, I didn't have a didn't have a company that would pay for, uh, me to travel to these conferences, although that would be ideal. But I didn't have that opportunity.

Jay 00:15:04:

I definitely get that. I mean, currently, I'm working as a marketer. So what? I tell them like, Hey, I want to go to this event. They're like, Oh, is it like Adobe Maximum like, No, it's pie Khan and it's in Pittsburgh and it's for a week and they're like,

Jay 00:15:21:

Yeah, I know you can. You can take vacation and and do that but I think some time off exactly. And I think that that's the being that

Jay 00:15:32:

I hope.

Jay 00:15:33:

I hope we learned from this this time of not being able t gather in place. I mean, we watched

Jay 00:15:41:

some of the largest conferences in the world. Some of the largest tech conferences in the world moved an online platform and become available for the first time for so many people that whether you can afford a ticket or you can't afford travel and things like that one of like, I think the second conference I ever went to, the only reason I went was because

Jay 00:16:04:

I split my hotel fair with a friend of mine.

Jay 00:16:07:

I got my flight covered by the conference organizers, so the only thing I had to pay for like in full was my ticket to the conference, and the tickets were like 25 bucks. And it was like, So for like that, it was like, Yes, this is This is exactly how I go to this conference. But every other conference, like, I like local conferences. I like the small, like, two day conferences that air like $50 for a ticket, and you only got to get a hotel room for like, a single night because a nobody trying to pay thousands of dollars out of their own pocket to go to an event and

Jay 00:16:45:

and you could just present it online like I love how pie cascades like they live stream their conference like the entire like If you don't have a ticket, that's fine. Just log onto YouTube and it's there. It's being presented live. And then, like North Bay Python, they do. They work with, uh,

Jay 00:17:02:

a company called Next Day Video, and

Jay 00:17:06:

we're literally giving the conference talk and then getting an email like an hour and a half later, like Hey, do your do you consent to release this video on the YouTube and it's like all day and I was quick and like, literally, you got conference videos up the next day and you're like,

Jay 00:17:20:

This is what? This is how it should be. Like, I'm glad that a lot of these places put their videos and stuff up, but

Jay 00:17:26:

I love that they're smaller conferences that are able to be like, as soon as the talk is given, It's like we're already getting it ready for the rest of the world to consume.

Wayne 00:17:35:

Yeah, with this, I guess, with this whole Kobe environment.

Wayne 00:17:40:

And once you go back to, like, quote unquote normal. Ah,

Wayne 00:17:45:

I guess environment or situation, um, I'm hoping, and I tweeted this out that I'm hoping all these, like developer conferences have more, um, accessible type of means of,

Wayne 00:17:59:

I guess,

Wayne 00:18:00:

showing off the different keynotes and different workshops via, like, streaming tools like YouTube or twitch,

Wayne 00:18:09:

and hopefully be a little bit more accessible to develop those who can't afford to go out to these

Jay 00:18:14:


Jay 00:18:28:

All right, let me tell you all story

Jay 00:18:31:

in 2018 to amazing movies came out that absolutely changed

Jay 00:18:38:

my mind, set on

Jay 00:18:42:

what was important in black cinema,

Jay 00:18:45:

and that was

Jay 00:18:47:

Black Panther

Jay 00:18:48:

and Spider Man into the spider verse. I think you know where I'm going here. If you don't well, listen anyway,

Jay 00:18:56:

2018 was also the same year that my daughter was born,

Jay 00:19:00:

so I spent most of 2018 either

Jay 00:19:04:

anticipating my first child or not sleeping because of my first child.

Jay 00:19:12:

One of the things that stressed me out more than anything was the lack of representation

Jay 00:19:18:

for people of color

Jay 00:19:20:

in the space

Jay 00:19:22:

in any space. I mean the fact that we have an entire month where we can talk about all the great African Americans and black, um,

Jay 00:19:34:

ethnic groups and individuals that did amazing things. The fact that we cover all of that in one month kind of tells you that there's a lack of information and knowledge and observance

Jay 00:19:49:

of people of color doing amazing things.

Jay 00:19:53:

I've said it before, and plenty of the interviews that I've had and that I've given with people that I think that the biggest thing that is

Jay 00:20:05:

the biggest thing that impacted me

Jay 00:20:09:

in my career path

Jay 00:20:11:

was finally seeing people that looked like me

Jay 00:20:16:

being successful, seeing people in the position that I'm in now making it. In fact, that's What my life goal is is to find people of all races, all ethnicities, all sexual orientations that are like me in some way, shape or form, and to show them

Jay 00:20:38:

that just because they're weird just because they're into rock and, like all other black friends aren't just because they like computers or whatever, that makes you normal.

Jay 00:20:49:

And you have a pathway to success

Jay 00:20:52:

you're talking to, Ah, college dropout that is doing amazing for himself in his family.

Jay 00:21:00:

But I didn't see that growing up. I saw drug dealers. I saw crackheads.

Jay 00:21:06:

I saw dropouts, rejects.

Jay 00:21:09:

I saw all of these things, but I saw a lack of success.

Jay 00:21:15:

Fast forward to 2018.

Jay 00:21:17:

I am for the first time seeing superheroes being portrayed as people of color.

Jay 00:21:23:

I knew the story of Black Panther following in the comics, but it wasn't one that was told. It was one that was kind of behind the scenes a little bit. So it was great to see these stories being put on screen, not stories about civil rights.

Jay 00:21:41:

It's so important that we have those conversations,

Jay 00:21:44:

but I'm tired of people of color only being asked to sit at the table to talk about their troubles.

Jay 00:21:50:

So to actually have someone come in and be a superhero meant the world to me.

Jay 00:21:55:

Then I saw Spiderman into the spider verse.

Jay 00:21:59:

I knew of Miles Morales,

Jay 00:22:02:

but that was just another example of breaking into a space that was primarily not reserved

Jay 00:22:11:

for black people. For people of color, people of color didn't have a spot in

Jay 00:22:17:

animated cartoons.

Jay 00:22:20:

And if they did, it was always the gangbangers and the Gangsters or the B rated superheroes like Static Shock.

Jay 00:22:32:

One of the people that helped

Jay 00:22:34:

make that a reality

Jay 00:22:38:

passed away.

Jay 00:22:40:

Chadwick Boseman,

Jay 00:22:42:

someone who had

Jay 00:22:45:

the suave and swagger of

Jay 00:22:50:

an address, Elba or a Denzel Washington,

Jay 00:22:53:

but was making stuff for my generation and for the generation that would come behind me,

Jay 00:23:00:

someone that spent

Jay 00:23:03:

the primary portion of his most successful moments

Jay 00:23:08:


Jay 00:23:09:

disease and illness,

Jay 00:23:13:

someone that was taken away really early.

Jay 00:23:17:

I had this whole thing planned out about how August was over and how it was starting September off of my Boo Joe and all that stuff. But then I realized it was so much more important

Jay 00:23:28:

to take a second

Jay 00:23:30:

in a world that's full of hatred in a world that's full of protest ing and riots in a world that's full of disease

Jay 00:23:38:

to just stop and bring a little clarity toe why

Jay 00:23:43:

people like Chadwick, Boseman or so

Jay 00:23:47:


Jay 00:23:50:

And he's not the last person.

Jay 00:23:52:

I'm glad to see that we have new action stars. I'm glad to see people like Michael B. Jordan, who have been watching since he was a kid on hardball.

Jay 00:24:02:

I'm glad that we can see

Jay 00:24:04:

black executives like Soma ST John.

Jay 00:24:09:

I'm glad that we're starting to see these things,

Jay 00:24:13:

but I have to stop and take a moment

Jay 00:24:16:

for a younger version of me

Jay 00:24:20:

that wish he would have been a kid when he first saw Black Panther

Jay 00:24:25:

that he would have been a kid when he first found out about Miles Morales.

Jay 00:24:31:

I'm sad,

Jay 00:24:33:

and I mourn the loss of Chadwick Boseman,

Jay 00:24:37:

King T'challa.

Jay 00:24:39:

But I'm encouraged

Jay 00:24:41:

because I know that he left a legacy

Jay 00:24:46:

that will hopefully inspire my little daughter

Jay 00:24:50:

and will inspire more people like me

Jay 00:24:54:

in the future.

Jay 00:24:57:

Thanks for listening, everybody having your host, J. Miller. This has been the pit show, the first episode of the Reboot

Jay 00:25:04:

Thank you so much for enjoying.

Jay 00:25:09:

The pit show was hosted, edited and produced by me. J. Miller. You can connect with me online at K. J. Why Miller on Twitter? Or you can check out my website at K. J. Why? Miller dot com

Jay 00:25:22:

My guest for the episode Waas Bane Jones

Jay 00:25:27:

Follow him on Twitter at Wayne of life.

Jay 00:25:31:

That's gonna do it for this week. I've been your host, J. Miller. Thank you so much for listening. And until next time,

Jay 00:25:38: